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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2013 20:33:53 GMT
Renen's character was caught by an enemy group and the dm did not allow him to flee from combat as per the normal rules for fleeing. As such, it played out where his character was destroyed, not simply killed, but he was allowed to use 2 hero points to be reincarnated at no xp or rp gold loss several days later at 0 hp.
I myself and several others have expressed their concern about how this cheapens character death and the point of faction warfare.
My question is how could this be allowed as it sets a terrible precedence for future cases, why raid another faction if they don't stay dead and can just raid you back.
This has been created as an open thread so anyone with additional thoughts / concerns / or objections can post them here and we could discuss this with the dm's.
--gerath oathbreaker
missed the main point, we all live and die by our choices and actions. if i walk into a dracolich's cave, i'm going to die and that is the end of it. he was in the wrong place at the wrong time.
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Del
Heraldry of Nise
Listening to the floating lady in the sky...
Posts: 128
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Post by Del on Sept 18, 2013 20:42:21 GMT
Also the only reference to a flee rule comes second hand from the thread about changing flee rules. Can we please have clarification on the flee rules in both npc and pc combat. Is there also chase/trailing/tracking rules to append?
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johan
Heraldry of Nise
Posts: 58
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Post by johan on Sept 18, 2013 20:46:23 GMT
I think we should wait for an official response from the GM's before we start getting all upset about it. After thinking about it for a little bit I decided that if a character wants to use Hero points to reincarnate himself as the cheat death function it's not exactly unheard of in the pathfinder universe. There are ways to come back from the dead and that is not canon breaking. However I agree it should not be done with no xp or gold loss if your character actually died.
I think that if a player REALLY likes the character he is playing and doesn't want to lose it they should be able to spend a number of hero points but they have to start back at level 1 with no RP gold or xp and and then not be able to earn hero points for 2 or 3 levels. There should be a severe penalty for dying even if we are allowed to come back with hero point expenditures but I kind of what to hear the GM response to this before things get really out of hand.
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johan
Heraldry of Nise
Posts: 58
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Post by johan on Sept 18, 2013 20:52:42 GMT
My apologies. Apparantly this was already ruled on. Carry on with where you were going with this. Apparantly those hero points are really really useful to have...
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cybernx
Blackwater Pirate
Posts: 382
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Post by cybernx on Sept 18, 2013 21:34:38 GMT
He came back basically unharmed? I thought he just recreated his PC at lv 1 and came back that way.
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Post by Silver on Sept 18, 2013 21:38:49 GMT
Well, that was an option for if I actually died.
Here, Clout ruled I can use hero points to survive the ordeal.
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Post by Colin Clout on Sept 18, 2013 21:41:21 GMT
I did not exclusively allow Renen to do this because the he was not allowed to flee a PvP. This had nothing to do with it. Cheating death is an option for everyone as long as they have two hero points. The circumstances of the death are irrelevant. He was not reincarnated, he chose to use an option that has been available to everyone from day one, (and used multiple times for the record). You are the one setting a dangerous precedent by asking us to deny cheating death to a player who has two hero points. Any one of you could be next. Do you want to be told that you cannot cheat death even though you specifically saved your hard earned hero points just for such an occasion?
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Wyatt
Blackwater Pirate
Posts: 214
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Post by Wyatt on Sept 18, 2013 21:45:32 GMT
I just want to make the point that his body was dismembered after death...
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Post by Colin Clout on Sept 18, 2013 21:54:06 GMT
The circumstances are irrelevant. The presiding GM would have altered the encounter and prevented such a gruesome death had he been aware that the cheat death option was available to him. The only real question that remains is how we act moving forward.
1. Players must remember on their own to declare cheat deaths so that the encounter can be altered rp wise and the presiding GM can interrupt the death. 2. GMs must always remember to remind players during an encounter that the cheat death option is available. 3. Players may use their cheat death option retroactively altering a PC death. ( As renen has done.)
Choose carefully cause you may be next.
And if anyone believes OOC that Renen is a god, see if he lives next time he dies without hero points.
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Post by Silver on Sept 18, 2013 22:00:38 GMT
Thank you for clearing this up Clout. I think the reason the state of my remains was not taken into account, is because if cheat death only prevented one hit, then EVERYONE would just destroy the opponents body. (Cremation for the good, evisceration for the evil, and either for Neutral). That would completely eliminate the whole "cheat death" thing.
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Post by Steinhoff the Blooded on Sept 18, 2013 22:17:08 GMT
Ok all good with Clouts explanation thanks for your time clout.
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Post by Steinhoff the Blooded on Sept 18, 2013 22:18:47 GMT
Should we start a poll/proposal for the cheat death options??
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Post by Deleted on Sept 18, 2013 22:19:38 GMT
Thanks clout. What really bothered me was the way it was handeled ie. All the nonsense and then not dying. Had the dm been aware and creates an intervening party to save his life there would have been no complaints. Once again thanks for clearing that up.
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Post by Silver on Sept 18, 2013 22:20:04 GMT
I do hope he can come back soon. But it seems he is still busy with real life. I wish we could all live in the internet. W/o all that "real life" stuff.
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Post by Sentar(Spade) on Sept 18, 2013 23:20:25 GMT
To clarify his fleeing he allows hemata to bind him in rope, at that point I felt rolling 4 or higher on a 1d100 did not do the encounter justice
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