Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2013 22:31:54 GMT
Proposal:
1s and 20s are not special numbers with regards to skill checks. As per the normal rules, they add +1/+20 to their modifier. A 1 is usually a failure unless the task is very easy, and a 20 is usually a success unless the task is very difficult, but you can't automatically fail / succeed a skill check with a natural 1 / natural 20.
Current Rule:
When a 20 is rolled on a skill check, the skill check automatically succeeds. When a 1 is rolled on a skill check, it fails. This is a house rule.
Problem 1: Any time you can take 20, you automatically succeed. Some DCs are designed such that you need a reasonable score in the ability to succeed even with a take 20. This house rule unbalances this situation, and means that as long as you can make the check, you can succeed. Common “take 20” skills include Disable Device (when used to open locks), Escape Artist, and Perception (when attempting to find traps). Not only is it silly that it's impossible to keep someone bound, it breaks disbelief.
Problem 2: You can accomplish ridiculous feats by trying a bunch of times. For example - imagine you're a first level wizard with a -1 to climb checks. You are presented with a slick glass wall that is 30 feet high. You decided that you're going to try and climb it in a single move action, which means that the DC, which was already ridiculous, is even worse. Fortunately, failure just means that you fall to the ground, which means you fall 0 feet. So, you try it 20 times, and eventually you roll a 20 and surmount the 30 foot wet glass wall. Or maybe you swam up a waterfall... who knows?
Problem 3: It's better to be lucky than good. The level 20 assassin with hide in plain sight and the stealth score of a minor deity wants to assassinate someone. What's the best defense? 20 peasants. Not even 20 peasants with good spot checks. Just 20 peasants who can raise an alarm. Because at least 1 out of 20 of them will probably roll a 20 on the check and see the assassin.
Problem 4: Sometimes, epic level characters can't tie their shoes. If a character has a high enough check that their modifier is higher than the DC, I take it to mean that such a skill check is as easy to them as breathing, and shouldn't fail 1 time in 20.
Edit: To be clear, a vote of nay means that Skill checks should NOT be able to auto succeed / auto fail, and that the proposal is passed.
1s and 20s are not special numbers with regards to skill checks. As per the normal rules, they add +1/+20 to their modifier. A 1 is usually a failure unless the task is very easy, and a 20 is usually a success unless the task is very difficult, but you can't automatically fail / succeed a skill check with a natural 1 / natural 20.
Current Rule:
When a 20 is rolled on a skill check, the skill check automatically succeeds. When a 1 is rolled on a skill check, it fails. This is a house rule.
Problem 1: Any time you can take 20, you automatically succeed. Some DCs are designed such that you need a reasonable score in the ability to succeed even with a take 20. This house rule unbalances this situation, and means that as long as you can make the check, you can succeed. Common “take 20” skills include Disable Device (when used to open locks), Escape Artist, and Perception (when attempting to find traps). Not only is it silly that it's impossible to keep someone bound, it breaks disbelief.
Problem 2: You can accomplish ridiculous feats by trying a bunch of times. For example - imagine you're a first level wizard with a -1 to climb checks. You are presented with a slick glass wall that is 30 feet high. You decided that you're going to try and climb it in a single move action, which means that the DC, which was already ridiculous, is even worse. Fortunately, failure just means that you fall to the ground, which means you fall 0 feet. So, you try it 20 times, and eventually you roll a 20 and surmount the 30 foot wet glass wall. Or maybe you swam up a waterfall... who knows?
Problem 3: It's better to be lucky than good. The level 20 assassin with hide in plain sight and the stealth score of a minor deity wants to assassinate someone. What's the best defense? 20 peasants. Not even 20 peasants with good spot checks. Just 20 peasants who can raise an alarm. Because at least 1 out of 20 of them will probably roll a 20 on the check and see the assassin.
Problem 4: Sometimes, epic level characters can't tie their shoes. If a character has a high enough check that their modifier is higher than the DC, I take it to mean that such a skill check is as easy to them as breathing, and shouldn't fail 1 time in 20.
Edit: To be clear, a vote of nay means that Skill checks should NOT be able to auto succeed / auto fail, and that the proposal is passed.